Category: the Rant Board
Anyone on here who works in technology - programmer, technician, hardware / electrical engineer, you name it, you've *all* seen this:
Our profession is the one most taboo in any conversation under any circumstance, it seems. You could more easily be a sex worker and provide lurid details at a church function than be one of us and lend a hand to someone in 'mixed company' *after they asked you*, and *on your day off*.
I'm not talking about how we all don't want to talk shop at the party after work / someone wants to come ask you how to fix their PC running wide open to the universe and acting as Virus Receiver / Dispenser of the neighborhood. That's definitely worth a rant, maybe, but what I'm referring to are all those who hear so much as a technical word and they're jumping up and down like spoiled children all upset. Even on here, which appears to be a rather tech-savvy community it will happen.
These are the type that barge straight into a conversation when someone has asked you for a little help, you (maybe grudgingly) offer it, on your time off I might add, after you've been doing programming or technician or whatever work all week. Worse than having an intrusion into your day off / weekend is this spoiled brat who has no consideration for the person needing help. It's almost as though we as technical people are to be ashamed of what we do: not just ambivalent or - God forbid, actually like it on some level.
So, I say, game on. If that's how they want it, let's give it to 'em. You know very well many of these will come crawling back without the least apology and begging you for help. If we're so despicable for what we do, they forfeit what they apparently don't want anyway: no help ever.
I did this once, and made one quit: a buddy of mine came up to me, privately I might add, asked about his PC, something his kids had done. I don't remember: who does after awhile?
Note I mention he came up privately. If it were a car he had a question about, I wouldn't have to add this. It's only technology people: not rapists, child molesters, executioners or anyone else, basically ours is the one that should someone approach us for help, we're to apologize for any discussion of it in a public place.
But anyway I was giving him a bit of help, when one of these came barging into the room and started the berating, which I've seen even on here, about technical talk. The poor guy just needed a bit of help, and I offered it as a friend even though sure, i'm off work and like anyone else appreciate the time off.
So here's what I did, and I suggest we start it on here:
I told her then and there, "Don't ever come to me for help, ever, for anything technical at all." As I said, if we're so despicable that even the mention of what we do is so offensive, wouldn't wanta put anybody out now. You know what? I made it stick, too. She came back - don't they always? - and was beggin' for help, it was her kids had done something on her computer. Too damn bad. As I said, I made it stick: something I never did then, though I do more now.
So, Let's us technical people do as the stores do who put up the writers of bad checks in their windows. Anyone giving someone grief on here for providing technical help, put their name in this thread. And those of us that do this for a living, let's not render any assistance.
After all, amongst all the specialty type topics mentioned in public places, only things technical are the SNAFU, so: SNAFU it shall be, then. No help, ever. By not helping them, ever, you're giving them exactly what they think they want. They're the ones, not us, who have singled our profession out exclusively as one they find totally offensive in a public space - even two people at a coffee shop. Since it's so despicable to them, yuo're only doing them favors by getting on board with this.
It's not like what we do is some secret society or anything. In fact, most answers you could find on Google, if you know so much as to deride us. I wouldn't know: I don't deride my electrician friend, my architect friend, mechanics I know or any medical people I know (some subjects from there can totally put you off your food), or teachers talking about students, or football fans talking about football.
In short, I can walk into a room and not know anything about a particular conversation and wait my turn / maybe even learn something, but certainly not butt in and impose my disgust at the mention of a word from a profession my sorry little self-esteem can't help that I don't know. But not so with these people and technology / you giving someone a hand when they asked you to on your day off.
So if technology work is so unacceptable, speak up, and all of us won't help you, ever. Remember, fellow technology people, they're the ones that find what we do more despicable than some people behind bars. After all, they're likely to bleat about giving a raper a chance, while berating you for doing a bit of a good deed on your day off. Notice they're not doing this to the lawyers, doctors, architects, electricians, or other people who are asked things in 'mixed company', it's just us.
After my friend from Google sent me a snippet from an article by one of these etiquette nazis promoting their disgust at what we do, I got him onboard with this also. He went so far as to say it would be unbridled awesomeness if their names could go up in electronics stores: Treat them the way a sex shop would treat a minor: You can't come in here. That's how they want it after all.
So, just as in real life you would 86 someone from assistance after they lampoon you for lending some to someone else, let's put names on here of people who do said lampooning, and do them a favor by not ever providing assistance.
It's no more harsh than they are to us. In fact, we're not even treating them with contempt as they do us, outcasting what it is they do beyond other 'respectable?' professions. We're just giving them exactly what they wish for, in full measure.
If you're one of the many who doesn't do this, welll, you'll remain unaffected by it.
I'm completely confused here. What on Earth is wrong with tech talk? Why would people put it down or feel uncomfortable discussing it in public? I sometimes get that with my crafts like basketry, chair caning and the like, but technology? *shrugs*
I don't think I've ever been rude on public quicknotes when one person is giving advice to another. But I do wonder sometimes why these people can't take their tech chats private. I'm not tech savvy at all and feel very left out when a conversation is completely over my head. So just acting as devil's advocate here, maybe that's why you run into that attitude on here and elsewhere. Maybe the people who interrupt just feel completely lost when it comes to tech stuff.
Having said all that, I actually admire you for sticking to your guns regarding telling that person never to ask you for help. I'm a firm believer in saying something and then sticking to it.
What? people are rude about tech talk? I've honestly never seen this happen, although I don't know any professional tech people. Sounds like it's a bit like being an attorney. It never fails - the instant I tell people I'm an attorney, I get rude lawyer jokes, groans or generally treated like I kick puppies for a living. whatever. I always remember that crap when they come asking for free legal advice. Good for you for sticking to your word. If they're not going to treat you with respect, they don't deserve your help.
There are many things that I don't follow, from American politics, to American sports, to many tv shows to modern music. So naturally, I can't join in those conversations as easily as others. But I either shut my mouth and learn or try to get involved in a positive way. Why bash something just because you're not into it?
LibraLady, there are many conversations I see on Public quicknotes or anyplace else that are outside of my area of expertise. I'm nothing more than a fairweather fan of my local sports team, yet that doesn't mean I have to become intimidated because someone else talks sports.
I'm a below-average handy guy around the house, but that doesn't mean when people discuss plumbing, household remodeling and the like, that I have to feel put out. Man, I can think of a lot of things that get discussed that most of us don't have expertise in, and many go over our heads, unless we listen and learn some.
But if it's technology, it's the derision. Me and a few bird-lover friends may discuss bird migrations, and others around us might say something like they'd never thought of this or that, but they don't deride us for watching, comparing notes, even if it is in a public place. My point has just been there are all sorts of fields most of us know nothing about from medical, to teaching, to psychology, to legal / law enforcement / defense, to stocks, to architecture, I could fill a book on stuff I'm not up on. That's one hell of a reason I'm not in a universe of one.
And I'll bet you don't ask any of these other professions to take their naughty talk someplace else, get that disgusting thing outa here ...
That is my point: We have so many things that come into a conversation of which we don't know anything about. So, either tune out or listen and learn some. I admit, with some things, I may well listen, but I don't seem to get the hang of it or learn that much. But it would be silly of me to make the lives of medical or psychology or similar people difficult because it happens to be one of those things I don't get that much.
I wanta know what makes our profession, what makes us, so damned despicable. Come on out now, and tell us, those of you so easily put out by a technical conversation. Why is it that we have to apologize and take that elsewhere, when every other profession can speak freely in a public place? What is it we've done to you?
Or, do you know so much about every other profession that it's never ever Greek to you? Wow! On thge one hand, you could come off as cool: on the other life must be boring knowing so much. So get your hate on, do whatever you must, but have the courtesy to come on out now and tell us what makes us, and our profession, so different than every other conceivable profession, all of which have terminology.
And you think we have jargon? I started a radio class I could not finish because of otherthings came up - something for my role in the Coast Guard, and I'm telling you, those people have pages and pages and pages of words you have to memorize before you even come close to a primitive understanding. I'm not even there, and yet if I'm around them and they're talking, I take what I can (sparse litttle at that), and leave the rest. I'm talking entire paragraphs where not a word would have been intelligible until I'd read some of the study material.
And you haven't been around art people expostulating on things the rest of us didn't even have a clue existed? Well, probably you have: you only find all of that acceptable, but you have singled us out. It's game time, now.
Tech talk is Greek to me, same as financial talk, that's why I have never been on the isn't it called "Geeks R Us" board? I would be totally without a clue. But I'm not going to complain about someone else talking about computer hardware and what have you.
Leo I don't blame you for not wanting to give tech help in your off time. I think it takes a lot of nerve, for example, for someone at a party to ask a guest who is a dentist to look at a filling or give advice about his dental work. It's considered proper etiquette to tell the guest asking "Make an appointment with me during my office hours." I seriously consider some of these folks my husband is friendly with to be moochers, coming around only to get computer or blue ray dvds fixed or resumes edited. To heck with "friends" like that. They should call the 1-800 number for Dell or whoever the manufacturer of their computer is. That's what technical support get paid to do...provide assistance during their working hours.
People have asked me questions about their lab results, even offered to show me a printout of their results & interpret 'em. My SIL some years ago asked if I knew why she wasn't conceiving a third child. Even if I knew, it isn't my place to tell 'em as I am not a doctor or a nurse practitioner, much less authorized to order tests or interpret results. In some states you can order a particular test on yourself, for example I went hiking in a wooded area & I'm fatigued, I'd like to be checked for lyme disease, or I missed my period & want a pregnancy test, in others you can't, a doctor or nurse practitioner must do this for you & only he or she can even give you the results, much less interpret 'em or pronounce a diagnosis. I must legally tell 'em I'm not only clueless I couldn't say anything even if I wasn't, or I'd no longer have a job in this field. Stick to your guns in not offering technical assistance outside of your working hours.
I have to disagree, except in cases, like medical ones, where it really wouldn't be advisable to answer such a question without proper training or knowledge on the situation. If the person is asking nicely, then what's wrong with simply answering a question? Why should said person have to call tech support when a technology expert is right there? I don't mean that he/she should take an hour of your time, but there should be nothing wrong with a question or two. And yes, if I was at a party and had a problem with my teeth, I would ask a dentist to at least take a look if one were present.
Actually, one of the reasons I rarely participate in or even have public quicknotes turned on is the number of conversations that go on that I think should be private. I don't know why so many people have to have private conversations in public unless it's to show off how many people they know and can talk about personal things with. I've never asked any of them to take these conversations private, I just simply turn off public qn's. Now if only I could turn off public conversations in public places the same way. Sometimes I think the whole reason people talk on their cell phones every where they go is just to be obnoxious. I'd like to tune out, but it's hard when someone is right beside you talking very loudly. I know I've strayed off topic, I'm just trying to make the point that I don't just get annoyed with techy conversations. I get annoyed with any kind of conversation held very loudly in public that I think should be private.
Asking a technical question is one thing, like "What would you reccommend for security?", but some of these folks we know take our family time for problems with the Magic Jack...um don't they have a toll free number to call...they bother my husband before he leaves for work or when he's just gotten home from driving a route all day, once I had been on the nebulizer a few days back & had to deal with a cigar smoker in the park that day, where I was feeling a little off, to find out someone I had agreed to help with a resume "as she thought there were jobs for her but there weren't" had just spent two months overseas. TWO MONTHS?! I could see a few weeks of R&R, but how are you going to find a job here if you're away for two months? There are public libraries where computers can be borrowed for an hour, printing charges are nominal, and help centers for some of this other stuff. IMO we're not doing ourselves or them any favor by bailing 'em out, and I think there's a time for work & I time for rest.
Ok LibraLady, so who decides what's for public consumption and what isn't? Sounds like the job of an elitist dictator.
So can teachers discuss things? Can fello Coast Guard or other military folk discuss things? Do we all have to ask each other if each other's world is big enough to include things we may or may not know about?
Frankly, on here and elsewhere, there's a lot of discussions I walk in on, and I don't know what it's about, don't really understand it. However, I'm usually a. educated and b. have my curiosity sated.
It would be pretty arrogant of me to assume people should take something private simply because *I* don't understand all there is to it. I guess that's where we end up with what Maya Angelou describes as weak tea and melba toast: Talk about nothing, because can't have any element of any conversation appear that someone, somewhere, just might not know something about.
I'm glad that's not my universe: I've learned a lot over the years by being around people who understood, and talked about, things I didn't fully understand.
I don't think you're getting my point at all, and frankly, I don't feel like debating it further on the boards. I'm not against people talking on publics. I was just trying to offer one possible reason for people getting upset with a lot of tech talk. Have you ever heard the term playing devil's advocate?
Naturally. I still have not had my question answered:
While every other profession has jargon, some far more than ours, and they are free to participate with one another in public, why not us? This is where we always get the shut-down response from people. I shouldn't have singled you out, LibraLady, that part wasn't fair: Your response is basically that of the masses. Absolutely nothing original or even could be said hostile there, no more than the masses. However, what is it about what we do, or may discuss when there is more than one of us present, that makes everyone despise us in a public setting?
We all are in public settings where there are a lot of professions, where two or more people happen to discuss something, and the rest of us don't really get it. Maybe, if we're nice about it, we'll await our turn and ask a question or more without making a pest of ourselves, but in the end having learned something. I'm not a chicken: if a child molester asked me what I found so despicable about him, I could say so: If a thief asked why I and friends didn't wanta hear about how he and his homies broke into people's houses, I could say so.
So game on: If a guy from google and a guy from Microsoft happen to coexist in the same party, and they may talk about an article or event that involves their industry, just like doctors or anybody else, what is it that makes them second class, while other professions may speak freely to one another in public? That is, devil's advocate or no devil's advocate, a very fair question.
After4 all, we're talking unequal treatment here, so, what, pray tell, is the reason?
Basically I have no answer other than my original guess. I'm not in your profession so obviously haven't experienced what you have. I don't get it either. People should either tune you and your techy friends out if they're not interested or ask questions to become more informed. Hostility doesn't make sense to me.
Sounds like what happened during my wife's brother's wedding. Quite apart from the fact that his wife's mother more or less hijacked the whole affair despite the fact that it was his own mother, my now mother-in-law, who did most of the organization for the event. Well during the planning and even at the wedding there were enough English speakers involved that there was as much English as Spanish being spoken. Well Carmen's mother told everybody rather rudely to speak in Spanish because not everybody spoke English. Uhm, excuse me? But I don't believe you were in charge of this event. And I can totally understand where Leo's comingfrom since I've occasionally heard examples of it, where techy friends get to talking about something and someone else rudely chimes in and demands that the tech talk be stopped.
I'm all for inclusion, and frankly don't discuss technical data at parties - unless the occasional conversation surfaces.
However, I'm extremely grateful most professions aren't publicly shamed in this way, and feel tree to engage in conversation with their peers in public. Granted, I don't always 'get the whole thing', but I most frequently come away having learned something. The real freaks here are the arrogant, self-absorbed, pernicious people who insist only the barest of conversation be tolerated, nothing anyone else may not know.
On the other side are the few times I've been in the presence of what could be thought of as a renaissance person: you know the type, really understands an astounding amount on such a vast array of subject material it's really hard to imagine it's all wrapped up inside of one single human being. Had a structural engineer friend like that when living in Florida: Have known a couple software people like that, and no, in a vast amount of areas, I didn't get it. I didn't fully grasp everything they were talking about. I'll have to read volumes of books to get on board with that, and I consider myself to be reasonably well-read. The experiences have all been amazing, but they would have been missed trains if I were too busy pretending I was still sixteen, pimply and awkward, trying to make sure I never surrounded myself with something I didn't know.
In my times overseas, I ran into all sorts of things I didn't fully understand and yet I certainly gained a lot. I'm sure others on here who have traveled abroad a lot more than I have would say the same.
I'm just glad most professions don't have the public shame attached as does ours. Because the rest of us, who are at least adult enough to do so, can learn a lot by what they say in a public conversation.
I've seen the rudeness myself and it is tragic. I feel sorry for certain people.